wobbly power wagon...

[jadmt]

My buddy has a 2020 PW he got it about a month after I got mine. We camp quite a bit together and he set his up with an RSI smart cap and James Baroud XXL tent. He has a Decked system as well. a few weeks ago we were headed out and he went to pass a semi and he said when he was next to it he thought he was going to crash and thought he had death wobble. I was in front of him and never had an issue passing it hit probably 85mph in doing so. Any way fast forward last week we went camping again and I was following him and he was all over the road. went thru a set of S turns at 55 mph which was posted limit and he again was all over. I told my wife "wow I bet he **** his pants there" I went through no bobbles or wobbles. We both run E rated 35's on AEV wheels. Both run the same PSI when loaded ie 55psi. he has Nitto RG and I have Toyo RT so very similar tires made on the same carcass. When we came back we pulled into a cat scale to see the weights fully loaded. We filled up before weighing. He was at 9500lbs I was at 8840lbs. His payload on the door says 1300lbs (he has a level 2) and mine says 1565 (I have a level 1) seems odd there is 265 more weight with a level 2 then level 1. Leather can not weigh that much more. Really suxs that a weekends worth of camping stuff puts you that far over the gvwr. He ordered a Thuren rear track bar as soon as we got home and is calling Carli tomorrow. CJC had a you tube video saying airbags don't really work. What are you guys running heavy doing to help your on highway ride? Anyone know if OEM 2500 tradesman coils have the same free length as PW coils? We both have ARB 50qt fridges and on this trip both were carrying a yeti 50 qt cooler with 20lbs of ice. This how we are both set up. I have 12500 miles on mine and has around 11000 miles on his so shocks should not be worn out.

 

[el_barto]

I would call Thuren regarding the spring lengths. I think the power Wagon springs are longer (in the front at least) to allow more droop with the sway bar d/c because regular 2500 shocks do not have enough extended length to be used on a PW
....I bet thuren knows though... plus they may be able to provide advice.

Regarding the payload: the Level 2 adds the power passenger seat which is a bunch of (heavy) motors... does his have a sunroof or ramboxes too? Those things add a lot of weight.

 

[jadmt]

I would call Thuren regarding the spring lengths. I think the power Wagon springs are longer (in the front at least) to allow more droop with the sway bar d/c because regular 2500 shocks do not have enough extended length to be used on a PW
....I bet thuren knows though... plus they may be able to provide advice.

Regarding the payload: the Level 2 adds the power passenger seat which is a bunch of (heavy) motors... does his have a sunroof or ramboxes too? Those things add a lot of weight.

I can not believe the 3 little motors weigh much total weight might be 15 pounds for the motors and brackets. No ram boxes. does have sun roof which I agree adds some weight. He is calling Carli first as when I asked Thuren they referred me to some one else for an answer, this was when I first bought my PW and wanted to get a fourwheel camper.

 

[H3LZSN1P3R]

Airbags will help because they outboard the bags about 11” each side wider so you will be more stable on the axles a larger sway bar would do the same too…. Is there any chance his sway bars are not staying locked when traveling the rear in particular?

 

[el_barto]

Rear swaybar doesn’t disconnect, only the front. If the rear sway bar is disconnect...well that would be a problem!!

dashboard should indicate a problem if it’s unable to reconnect the sway bar though.

 

[jadmt]

yes his front SW is working properly or at least his lights are not coming on and his rear one has not come unbolted. I actually checked that the first time we were out I thought well it was possible it had come loose or was under tightened from the factory but unfortunately that was not the issue.

 

[Brewbud]

Check front trackbar for tightness. His truck could have been aligned differently from the factory. Too much negative caster can give you some wander or a feeling of looseness. Double check tow too.

 

[jadmt]

Check front trackbar for tightness. His truck could have been aligned differently from the factory. Too much negative caster can give you some wander or a feeling of looseness. Double check tow too.

good points. He knows what too little caster feels like so I do not think it is that. We have done many jeep lifts over the years and if it were the alignment it would have reared it's head before he added a few extra pounds. I will check his track bar torq when we do the thuren track bar.

 

[AnthonyD1978]

Please keep us updated. I've very curious what the solution ends up being.
I'd TQ everything down and then get an alignment check as my first items.

FWIW. My payload says 1127. I have quite a bit of gear on my rig 24/7 also. I'm pretty sure I'm over my payload or close to it. I've done over 90 a few times when passing with no wobble. I'm on 37" KM3 and stock suspension. Carli Pintop on order.

 

[jadmt]

Please keep us updated. I've very curious what the solution ends up being.
I'd TQ everything down and then get an alignment check as my first items.

FWIW. My payload says 1127. I have quite a bit of gear on my rig 24/7 also. I'm pretty sure I'm over my payload or close to it. I've done over 90 a few times when passing with no wobble. I'm on 37" KM3 and stock suspension. Carli Pintop on order.

I could about guarantee you are over. I am not loaded to the gills and I am over.

 

[AnthonyD1978]

I could about guarantee you are over. I am not loaded to the gills and I am over.

Yes, I'm pretty sure I am. I really need to weigh the truck. It feels great though. No unexpected handling issues so far.

Is he showing any unusual/excessive tire wear?

 

[jadmt]

Yes, I'm pretty sure I am. I really need to weigh the truck. It feels great though. No unexpected handling issues so far.

Is he showing any unusual/excessive tire wear?

mine feels great too absolutely drives like I think it should. No his tires look perfect and he has almost 11,000 miles on them and has only rotated them once. He put them on as soon as he bought the truck. I literally just looked at them yesterday when he stopped by. I was thinking maybe his shocks were bad already and that often causes odd tire wear and his look fine.

 

[AnthonyD1978]

Well a bad shock could easily cause some really bad wobble. Are you sure he hasn't already blown one? Any fluids leaking from any of the shocks? Even the one over the center rear axle.

 

[jadmt]

Well a bad shock could easily cause some really bad wobble. Are you sure he hasn't already blown one? Any fluids leaking from any of the shocks? Even the one over the center rear axle.

no, shocks are spotless. if one was bad it has not spewed anything.

 

[gimmie11s]

Swap tires (him and you) to verify it's not a tire issue. I know you said they are "basically the same" tire, but it would be a quick/free project.

 

[Rockcrawlindude]

Swap tires (him and you) to verify it's not a tire issue. I know you said they are "basically the same" tire, but it would be a quick/free project.

Not a bad idea at all

 

[jadmt]

Swap tires (him and you) to verify it's not a tire issue. I know you said they are "basically the same" tire, but it would be a quick/free project.

it is not the tires, they were fine for over 10,000 miles I doubt they went bad. It has to do with the weight. Besides I literally just rotated mine and it has been 100 degrees here and his won't fit in my garage lol he did talk to Carli today on the phone and they told him exactly that, that PW can't handle that much weight. They recommended he try some air bags and go from there.

 

[jupp0r]

I’ve had pretty bad sway twice in my 2020 Power Wagon with 22k miles that’s right in the edge of maximum GVWR. There is a series of woops on CA-14 N that made electronic stability control kick in, no fun.

It got much better after I installed front and rear Thuren track bars, front Thuren springs, rear sway bar links and Fox 2.0 (waiting for King to make the 2.5s, hopefully this year lol).

I don’t know which of these fixed it, but it’s much much better now. I also run 50psi in the back (37x13.5R17 Cooper STT Pros), the added tire pressure was a great improvement.

 

[gimmie11s]

it is not the tires, they were fine for over 10,000 miles I doubt they went bad. It has to do with the weight. Besides I literally just rotated mine and it has been 100 degrees here and his won't fit in my garage lol he did talk to Carli today on the phone and they told him exactly that, that PW can't handle that much weight. They recommended he try some air bags and go from there.

Sooooo.. it's too hot for you to try.

On second thought.. just throw more money at it!

 

[jadmt]

Sooooo.. it's too hot for you to try.

On second thought.. just throw more money at it!

I understand where you are coming from but it is not the tires. When it was unloaded it was fine ie before he put the James Baroud RTT (160lbs) on (he also made his own rack out of unistrut and it has to weigh 70lbs) and filled his bed to the gills with camping gear, his truck hit the scales at 9500lbs. Carli told him that it was normal for a PW when they were over gvwr to act the way his did and that airbags would be the answer. He stopped over and we started looking at the stuff he had crammed into his decked drawers and he ~140lbs of stuff he did not need to be carrying (using a bathroom scale so not real accurate but a ballpark figure) He had 3 different stingers and two 2.5" to 2" adaptor sleeves among a bunch of other stuff. Carli does not sell air bags and they did not try to sell him a full suspension kit to solve his issues. one thing I think was a major contributor besides the roof top tent is he was hauling his Trek suspension mountain bikes on a hd Kuat bike rack which I figure the bike rack is over 50lbs and he is 6'6" so has a heavy bike probably 40lbs and his wife's bike is probably 35lbs so there is some leverage there.